Questions

(Quotes from Ed in Red)

Answers

Wed, 10 Dec 2003

Yes, you identify the mechanism behind continuing to set up dramas, in order to experience unexpressed feelings.

An alternative is to fully experience the feelings intentionally, with TTP.

Experience it Now

or set up dramas now.

Clip: http://www.medlina.com/pain.gif

Wed, 10 Dec 2003

Nuclear Engineer on Eurex

Some very bright scientists prefer  figuring things out to riding trends.

Proton:

"I'm a fundamental particle,

so I know I'm right."

Electron:

"You seem so positive."

Clip: http://www.eskom.co.za/

Wed, 10 Dec 2003

FAQ does not recommend specific parameters.  See Ground Rules. 

Short-term systems tend to succumb to transaction costs.

You might take your urges for swing-trading into TTP, as an entry point.

Swinging His Weight Around

Clip: http://max.levien.com/

 Wed, 10 Dec 2003

Change Based on Feedback

Yes.

Wed, 10 Dec 2003

Trend Traders tend to capture a lot of the major trends and lose on the small ones.

I don't know how you intend to use your percentage metric.

In order to capture 50% of a trend, before it ends, you would have to know the ending point, in advance.

If you really have that information, you might as well go for 100% of the move - or even more, if you can guess all the wiggles - the sky's the limit.

You might take your feelings of wanting to get the largest possible percentage into TTP.

If You Can See Clearly

that the Sky's The Limit

your neck might be exposed

Clip: http://www.cs.princeton.edu/

~sudhakar/pics/general/

Wed, 10 Dec 2003

Journaling Feelings

I keep a detailed, feeling intensive trading journal. This is a new experience for me and it is invaluable in identifying issues and feelings to take to the process.

I celebrate my feelings and recognize their positive intentions.

I am also starting to notice that there are very subtle differences between feelings that arise as part of long standing dramas and feelings that arise as protective warnings.

Wed, 10 Dec 2003

Experiencing / Analyzing


I'm not a tribe member but from what I understand from the example given on your site, it seems that a past experience which was negative or traumatic is re-emerging under our radar which we don't want to experience again?

And when that experience is remembered, it loses its grip on you since now you know the source?

What I don't get, is what fully experiencing a feeling has got to do with it.

If I have bad anxiety, which I always have, in the moment I'm aware of what's happening to me. Its uncomfortable for sure, but I am fully aware of the bodily reactions I am having such as shortness of breath and sweaty palms. But that doesn't seem to do anything at all.

Intentional experiencing of repressed feelings tends to  transform them into Aha's and tends to disappear the dramas surrounding them.

A Tribe can help you stay on task, since repressed feelings are, by nature, not particularly pleasant to experience.

Remembering an experience, talking about it, analyzing it, even writing about it does not seem to promote the abreaction.

Thinking About a Sneeze

is not the same as sneezing.

Clip: http://www.rockford.uic.edu/

Tue, 9 Dec 2003

Aha - Boredom

Yes, pain may arise from not accepting the system.

Also, from not accepting boredom.

The Positive Intention of Boredom

might be to find something

interesting to do

like paddle-ball,

playing the banjo

or running a web-site.

Clip: http://www.unitedcommand.com/

toons/boring.gif

Tue, 9 Dec 2003

Dream Terror 2

see: Dreams Mon. 1 Dec, 2003


Fear. Of what? Not sure, but it is enough to keep me from going on and being there with the feelings.

Too scary, too creepy. I judge those feelings as unbearable and I am unwilling to continue … my twin dogs as Ed says. I don’t know what death or going insane feels like but if I had to guess it would be something akin to what I’m experiencing in my semi-lucid dreams.

It frightens me to death. Two days running I was able to experience in a half sleep, half waking state such weird sensations of losing control, of something alien inside that writhes in terror when I focus my awareness on it. The writhing and terror is what I feel but it somehow seems to be me and not me at the same time.

It is very hard to describe. I’m getting closer but the fear of the unknown keeps me at bay.

Does this sound familiar to anyone else out there? Are there any tribe members with similar experiences?

I ask these questions as a way to confirm that I’m on the right track (in the absence of willing receivers) and not mentally deranged or possessed by an evil spirit.

The Twin Togs

 acceptance and willingness,

guard the gate to AHA.

TTP means the Trading Tribe Process;  TTP requires an intentional community, with members who commit to helping each other stay on task with experiencing their feelings.

DIM means Do It Myself; the results you are getting are consistent with the DIM process.

DIM

Preferring isolation to community

and agreement to growth.

Clip: http://www.ai.mit.edu/

~emax/alone.jpg

Tue, 9 Dec 2003

Knew Who Is

I was just wondering if you knew who is running the [xyz].com site.

I don't know how to knew something.

You might consider re-writing your question in SVO-p.

Tue, 9 Dec 2003

You seem skillful in enrolling people as your enablers ... to help you run away from your feelings  ... to drift off into commentary, theory and analysis.

You might take your run-off drama to a Tribe meeting.  Good receivers can celebrate your feelings with you, encourage you to experience them, and find their positive intentions.

Taking Feelings of Rejection

to the Tribe, is TTP.

Getting the Tribe to Reject You

is just more Drama

Clip: http://esart.com/paintings/

Tue, 9 Dec 2003

Commitment to Trend-Trading

Dear Mr. Seykota,

I recently ran into an article Do you buy breakouts? Think Again

http://biz.yahoo.com/tm/

031208/11017_4.html

The article points out that since 1993 where S&P rose over 145%, but a strategy that buys 10-day breakout with trailing stop at its 10-day average actually loses substantial money.

While I cannot justify the accuracy on the study, and certainly the study doesn't include any position-sizing methodologies, it has been wandering in my mind, as I've told you a week ago, that I still have some lingering doubts to completely accept trend-following.

I find it to be the root of my difficulties to stay committed, because I still lack the faith. As the Goethe's poem goes, "Until one is committed, there is hesitancy, the chance to draw back, always ineffectiveness ..."

In the FAQ on March 28, you said, "In the markets, just about everything works sometimes, and hardly anything works all the time." As I accept this statement, I keep thinking whether I can completely embrace trend-following as part of life, knowing that hardly ANYTHING (guess that includes trend-following) works all the time.

You have an interesting claim that all systems that make money trade trends
(FAQ, Dec 1), and that a definition of trend is that if you buy at A and sell at B, B must be greater than A for a profit. This is quite different from what most technical analysis books have.

Looking at some arbitrageurs and market-makers, they seem to make money using a system that is slight deviating than what one usually thinks of as "trade trends", by trading multiple instruments (eg. buy S&P e-mini @ 1060.25 and simultaneously sell S&P futures contract @ 1060.3) or leveraging the ability to buy at the bid and sell at the ask, while the market quote stays at a fixed level.

Now as I'm writing, it becomes increasingly clear to me that I am not trying to disprove your definition of trends or your claims that ALL systems that make money trade trends, but just that I am spending all these efforts trying to disprove trend-following so as to embrace it, so that I can commit myself without any reservation or hesitancy.

The article seems to show that a long-term trend system (that stays long the entire move - and does not buy a lot of breakouts) outperforms a short-term trend system that gets in and out on a 10-day rule.

It does not seem to speak against trend following.

Yes. You might take your feelings of doubt into TTP.

Tue, 9 Dec 2003

Short Signal ?

re: Sun, 7 Dec 2003 Some of your Systems

Sometimes systems offer up signals to go long, other times signals to go short.

The borderline between discretionary trading and system trading tends to blur as Fred and CM entwine.

Entwining

Promotes Synthesis

Clip: http://www.econ.nyu.edu/user/

Mon, 8 Dec 2003

Why and Because imply causality and invoke fundamentalist thinking.

John Lennon

All You Need is SVO-p

http://www.newgenevacenter.org/

portrait/lennon.jpg

Mon, 8 Dec 2003

Introduction


Dear Ed,

I am a futures trader in Columbus, Ohio. I have been doing it for 3.5 years. I have great research and trading skills for trading the SP futures market.

My philosophy is to use the ND, DJ, and RL to trade the SP on a 15-min chart. All markets are either going together, in which case is my breakout.

Or there is an inconsistency in the 4 markets, in which case a reversal occurs. I have been trading alone for the last 2.5 years and even though I feel incredible about my research, I would very much like to work with a trader more seasoned than myself.

I am committed to my craft and sure I could learn something from you. I learned the basics from [XXX] who was [YYY's] assistant. I developed my own trading strategy.

I know that you are a trend follower influenced by Donchian, and that you have mentored other traders.

I would very much like to talk to you, even if for a few minutes, to gain some further conviction concerning my trading strategy.

FAQ addresses questions of general interest to the trading community, by traders who wish to become examples and support each other. 

For private consulting, see the link on the Ground Rules page.

Mon, 8 Dec 2003

NLP

You might be the best source of information on how similar they are for you.

Sun, 7 Dec 2003

Risk Tolerance

Ed,

I've been scaling up at fixed dollar increments in the account.

Currently this is a linear relationship, but I've been realizing a desire to decrease risk over time in an asymptotic fashion if growth continues, which is a common preference. If I had 5 million dollars, I wouldn't trade aggressive margin, I would probably hold mostly treasury bonds. How did you define this utility curve in the early stages of your account when you wanted to go full steam ahead, but also felt there was more at stake?

Last week my scaling system gave me the green light to increase size, and it is so far feeling a little hot, especially approaching the holidays, and just above the scaling boundary. On the other hand, there seems to be a pickup in volatility and a likely equity curve run-up in progress. If you were trading relatively small lots would you adjust your position size based on these conflicting risks and opportunities?

I have been considering full size shorts and 2/3 size longs into new years. another alternative is to increase my artificial margin requirement, systematically bumping back down to the smaller size. another alternative is to skip holiday longs completely. Final alternative is to wing it and go on my feeling at the time of the trade.

You can simulate various risk management strategies to find the optimal for you.

You might also take your feelings, hunches and desires, as entry points, into TTP, to dissolve dramas you may be running in this area.

Red and Green

Hot and Cold

Long and Short

On and Off

Or ... just ride the trend.

Clip: http://www.montana.edu/

wwwufs/graphics/tour%20green%20light.gif

Sun, 7 Dec 2003

TTP Peels Away the Layers

Hi Ed,

As a result of doing TTP I have seen quite a few positive benefits in my trading, I recently looked at my monthly statements, since I started doing TTP there has been a steady improvement in my trading. Although an AHA eluded me all this time, it finally happened couple of weeks ago.

The episodes of self sabotage have reduced, however they still show up almost on a weekly basis.

I have developed some very good trading systems, they have been thoroughly back tested. A friend with whom I shared this mechanical system has been doing quite well - while in my case, due to self sabotage,  I have not done as well.

The system is fully automated, the computer monitors and executes the trades unattended, all I have to do is to turn on the computer and just let it run.

You seem to be asking for an analysis of Fred's motives. 

TTP does not attempt to analyze Fred, motives or anything else for that matter. 

TTP intends to connect Fred with CM so they can communicate experience.

You might take your feelings of wanting to stay in control, of not wanting to "let go" into the process as a starting point.

Letting Go

Sometime Initiates Soaring

Clip: http://tea.rice.edu/bergholz/

pics/html/page6.html

Sun, 7 Dec 2003

Some of your Systems

Hi Ed,

I am forwarding some information to you about adding some of your systems and money management strategies in to [xyz software]. In fact, [xyz] said that if they find systems helpful they will help market them to their customer base.

I mentioned to XXX, CEO of [xyz], that I sure wish we could get Ed Seykota to contribute a few of his systems in to [xyz]. See his reply back to me-

Dear YYY:

Excellent! If you could, please let Ed Seykota know that I will contact him [soon]

I will get him a free SDK license as soon as we have updated the SDK for 2004. However, if his systems have general appeal we might program them for him. We are currently promoting one other system provider and paying him a royalty, and the system provider is promoting [xyz] to his customers. We would do the same for Ed Seykota, provided everything else lines up.

-- XXX

If you are interested in working with [xyz] to provide some of your systems and key money management strategies, please let me know and I will let XXX know of your interest.

Trading algorithms are a part of trading, other important parts are risk management, attitude and knowing how to deal with feelings that arise during trading.

You might like to elaborate on how XXX intends to provide risk management, attitudinal and emotional support so traders are able to stay on task.

I wonder if XXX keeps track of how well his customers do once they buy his product, and if he publishes that data.

Buying a System

Might be different from being able

to get it to fly.

Sun, 7 Dec

Romantic Dramas

I read this Ugly post on FAQ and I feel like sharing my issue.

Over the past few years I have been feeling attracted to women who have no interest in me and so realizing my intention of being overlooked for someone else or getting rejection.

Sun, 7 Dec

Sat, 06 Dec 2003

Trading on the NASDAQ

Hi,

On Friday, trading in shares of Corinthian Colleges ( COCO ) were halted when the price fluctuated from $57.50 to a low of $39.25. This resulted in the halting of trading on the stock.

Trading was resumed, without any indication of an underlying problem. Over an hour later, the NASDAQ decided that the trades were cancelled, so those who had gone long had their buy orders cancelled and were now considered to be short. This has resulted in the accumulation of significant losses for many small investors.

FAQ does not offer instrument specific trading advice, recommend trades or attempt to predict anything. See Ground Rules.

As part of your risk management, you might consider keeping your position size appropriate to volatility.

The trade does not seem consistent with Trend Trading - You might take your urge to buy on dips into TTP as an entry point.

I do not follow how canceling a buy order makes you short. You might consider re-writing your description in SVO-p to clarify it.

Hot Coco

Prices Through Friday

No trades showing below 51.

Fri, 5 Dec 2003

Fractals and Trading

Hi!

I am wondering why you have information about fractals on your website?

The "information" about fractals is a poem, about borderlines and the search for them.

Note: "Why" questions are inherently ambiguous. For example:

From intention = result, the poem appears on the site "because" it is your intention to see it there.

You might take your feelings about asking "why" questions into TTP as an entry point.

 

The Borderline

Between Bullish and Bearish

 

can be as thin as an aha.

Fri, 05 Dec 2003

Fri, 5 Dec 2003

Ugly

Ed,

My whole life I have have been blessed with an ugly face and have a hard time getting women to like me romantically.

Doubling up on your efforts in the gym is just more "solving" - it just changes the details of the drama.

You might also take your feelings about your drama into TTP.  When you locate them, experience them and find their positive intentions, you may find your drama dissolving.

Perhaps, you are so intent on running your game, that you are overlooking  women who might be romantically attracted to your vulnerability, your willingness to share your feelings about your appearance.

Just a Reflection

until we learn to judge it.

Clip: http://uweb.superlink.net/

Fri, 5 Dec 2003

You are pretty good at  describing it, analyzing it and naming it. 

Now how about experiencing it.

Keeping you on task experiencing your feelings (instead of drifting off into analytics) is one of the functions of the Tribe.

Roller Coaster

Analysis differs from experiencing.

Same goes for the markets.

Clip: http://www.travelspots.com/

Fri, 5 Dec 2003

Intention for Practitioner's License

Ed,

My intention regarding a Practitioner's License is to help people become better parents.

Thank you for your commitment to helping children and for your willingness to deal with your own issues.

Anyone may assemble and conduct meetings to discuss, teach and use anything on the Trading Tribe Site - as long as it is (1) not-for-profit, (2) absolutely free to participants, (3) at the risk of the presenters and participants.  See FAQ Ground Rules.

If you wish to use the resources on this site, such as the TT logo, the name, Trading Tribe, and other terms of art, such as Fred, CM, and Hardball Process for profit, you may apply for a practitioner license.

The license certifies you have a good grasp of the theory and practice of TTP and that you are good at using them.

To proceed toward a license, send a case study, from your work, for publication of FAQ, demonstrating your understanding of the work, and  illustrating how you use it.

Trading Tribe FAQ

Thu, 4 Dec 2003

1st LA tribe meeting

Wow!

I mean ... Hi Ed.

I took the hot seat last night and followed a bunch of feelings until they let go. I had many different things happen to me in the hot seat and after I left the tribe meeting. At this time I can't verbalize anything about my experience last night.

Well, I can say two things:

Yes. 

Sounds like the LA tribe is working the process.

The Seat of the Action

Clip:

www.edsstudio.tripod.com/

Thu, 4 Dec 2003

Permission to Trade

I need someone to talk to in Madison Wi. that has been trading electronically in futures. I don't understand your reply on
precisions .

My personal system is not precise. I use a current price chart, watch price action, oi / volume increase or decrease , 14-20 day MA and a truthful or a lying fundamental.

What I'm asking you specifically is will you let me trade my 10,000 either on paper or for real with real entry and exit numbers.

(1) I have no evidence that I have authorization to either let you or not let you trade.

(2) Yes, numbers can exist.

If you want answers that make sense, consider asking questions that make sense.  You might show your questions to a few friends and see if they understand them.

Also, you might take your feelings about people not understanding you / you not understanding them into TTP.

Gibberish

communicates a lot

about how you feel about

clear communication.

Clip: http://hometown.aol.com/mlbmiller/

Thu, 4 Dec 2003

Thu, 4 Dec 2003

Intentional Provocation:

Nice story.

Here is some SVO-p provocation for you:

The Master commands ...

I usually pay ...

The Gift

is in the present

Clip: http://www-personal.engin.umich.edu/

Thu, 4 Dec 2003

Positives from London

Dear Ed,

The London tribe had its 4th meeting last night and I am happy to report that things are going well.

The changes I've noticed in my behaviours since attending tribe meetings include making more time for my family, being more courteous to my loved ones, taking less risk while driving and noticing things of beauty that have always been around me.

With regards to trading I trade less frequently, work harder at finding the right opportunities, keep positions for longer and only add to a position when they show me a profit.

These factors have contributed to far superior trading results then previously, for that I am eternally grateful to you, my tribe and the Trading Tribe process, thank you.

When I first showed an interest in the TT process my sole motivation was to improve my trading results, I didn't expect any other positives and didn't think my life needed any.

Wed, 3 Dec 2003

FAQ Inspires Wife to TTP

Hi Ed !

Latest FAQs give me much to consider ! Thank you. The small formula ...

intention = results

is the most powerful no-excuses goal/behavior aligning koan I've ever experienced. Focusing it on my life feels like an electric current blowing out past excuses, future doubts. It is the antidote to psychotherapy which of course employs the formula ...

results = everybody else's fault

to burrow further into the bundles of convoluted thought/emotion we label the past.

* * *

Yes.

Latest Attire for TTP

Clip: http://www.sulis.co.uk/pics/ch01li.jpg

Wed, 3 Dec 2003

Why

You might consider joining a Tribe in your area.

TTP does not respond to "why" questions as they are fundamentally ambiguous, even meaningless. 

Another approach is: try sharing your feelings around what you want to know.

The Wise Guys - Amusing

The Whys Guys - Confusing

Clip: http://www.umsl.edu/services/

Wed, 3 Dec 2003

Friends

Dear Ed,

I am just curious, are you still friends with Michael Marcus or not?

Wed, 3 Dec 2003

Student

Mr. Seykota,

I am a Junior at the Cox School of Business at Southern Methodist University in Dallas, Texas. The purpose of my e-mail is guidance, and your remarks in Jack Schwager's Market Wizards on how everyone gets what they want out of the market really hit home with me.

I don't care to make billions of dollars in the markets, but I do care about having success. What I want out of life and the markets is understanding.

You might try using SVO-p since there is no way to "was meant to do" things in the now.

Thu, 4 Dec 2003 08:41:52 +1100

Wed, 3 Dec 2003

NLP and Idioms

Dear Ed,


Some NLP authors state that experience is stored in the subconscious (Fred) in pre-verbal "files". They say that when we communicate through language there's a process of deletion / distortion / generalization of many aspects of our experience in the flow of experiences from Fred to CM.

Only when the experience is already in CM, it can be stored in language format so we can communicate with the world outside. This is why many times we say things that are not comprehended by others (the process deletes, distorts and generalizes aspects that our mind judges unnecessary, but are completely necessary for others, who do not share the same experiences that we have, understand). Even this explanation is subject to deletion / distortion / generalization and it is a reflex of what I know but not necessarily what others will understand.

Knowing this I observed a very interesting pattern regarding people who speaks more than one language.

I have studied in international (bilingual) schools all of my life. In those schools we had to study math, sciences, social studies ... in 2 languages (English and Portuguese).

Here where the pattern begins: I have always felt that the learning process in English was easier comparing to the learning process in Portuguese even though Portuguese is my first language. I did not know exactly why but it seemed English provided a more direct approach to knowledge than Portuguese, which I used to define as a more "bureaucratic" language (the same thing applies to Spanish and Italian, which are "cousin languages").

I'm 25 years old now and while reading and studying NLP I decided to test that old theory by talking to my old schoolmates. Surprisingly I was right (even though it's not a big data base, but it definitely shows a pattern): I talked to 22 old friends from 2 international schools. 18 of them shared the same opinion (and only 6 of these 18 friends have English as their first idiom); only 4 of them disagrees and thinks Portuguese is an easier language to learn things - now, here's also an interesting observation: 3 of those 4 colleagues had their first contact with English after they were 13 years old and 1 had her first contact with English when she was 9).

Now, I have also met children that came from non-English speaking countries when they were 3-4 years old. Those children spoke fluently English (school's idiom), Portuguese (school's and country's idiom) and their home idiom (Arab, German or Dutch) without messing up any of the 3 languages. This simply didn't happen. The child spoke all of the 3 languages with absolutely no problem, because he/she had learned those languages too early in life. We were used to it because a lot of friends were in that situation, but grown ups in that time (and also now) always were surprised with this fact.

So:

1. It seems that there are languages that provide a more direct approach to knowledge than others; therefore, learning may be easier in those languages.

This is the first indication I have that NLP authors are writing about Fred.

If you wish to cite a reference, you might do so by name.

TTP seems to compliment NLP.

Many linguistic processes, like how to move your lips and tongue, and how to parse sound waves back into words and meaning, occur "without thinking," under Fred's control.

I find more difference between SVO-p non-SVO-p people, and between people who see that intentions = results and those who don't - than between people of different languages.

People Might Differ

less by native tongue

and more by how they use it.

Clip: http://www.britannica.com/bcom/

images/world/nations-world-map.jpg

Wed, 3 Dec 2003

Where Is Michael Marcus

Dear Mr. Seykota:

My boss [XXX]  of [YYY] fund, Inc. read a short article on Michael Marcus ... we are interested in finding out more about Mr. Marcus and we were wondering if you would be able to tell us how to get in touch with him. I tried directory information in [City] but he is non-published.

We would appreciate any information that you might have.

FAQ respects private property, including private information.  If Mike happens to read this and writes in, I can send him your address.

Private Property

Under-Standing Capitalism

and Freedom

Clip: http://www.castsign.on.ca/

Tue, 02 Dec 2003

Percentage of Days

Under a Certain Draw Down Percentage as a Risk Metric

Part of back-testing is to determine position sizing and risk management strategies that fit within your drawdown tolerance envelope.

If you allow deterioration of your equity to continue after you penetrate your envelope, you may find you still have some "uncle" point that represents your absolute tolerance.

You might check your feelings about wanting to give a market a little more room, after it hits your stop.

Pulling the Stop

May Reduce it's Effectiveness

Clip: http://www.crh.noaa.gov/fsd/

Tue, 2 Dec 2003

Creeping Up On The "Real" Thing

Ed Says:

Some people like to approach the real thing slowly.

I encourage you to go at whatever pace you wish. As you proceed, slowly